Sunday, December 11, 2011

Americas and I

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For the second week in a row, the Senate on Thursday voted down proposals to extend the payroll tax holiday through next year. In the case of the Democrats' proposal, Republicans objected to the "millionaires surtax" that would be used to pay for it.
Ever since the idea of the surtax was introduced weeks ago, Republicans in Congress have railed against it, arguing that it is a direct hit on small-business owners and other job creators.
The argument is that many small-business owners report company profits on their individual taxes because of the way their businesses are structured. Sen. John Thune, R-S.D., says the surtax would hurt their ability to hire.
Republican Sen. John Thune of South Dakota says the "millionaires surtax" would hurt small-business owners' ability to hire new workers.
EnlargeJ. Scott Applewhite/Associated PressRepublican Sen. John Thune of South Dakota says the "millionaires surtax" would hurt small-business owners' ability to hire new workers.
"It's just intuitive that, you know, if you're somebody who's in business and you get hit with a tax increase, it's going to be that much harder, I think, to make investments that are going to lead to job creation," says Thune.
We wanted to talk to business owners who would be affected. So, NPR requested help from numerous Republican congressional offices, including House and Senate leadership. They were unable to produce a single millionaire job creator for us to interview.
So we went to the business groups that have been lobbying against the surtax. Again, three days after putting in a request, none of them was able to find someone for us to talk to. A group called the Tax Relief Coalition said the problem was finding someone willing to talk about their personal taxes on national radio.
So next we put a query on Facebook. And several business owners who said they would be affected by the "millionaires surtax" responded.
"It's not in the top 20 things that we think about when we're making a business hire," said Ian Yankwitt, who owns Tortoise Investment Management.
Tortoise is a boutique investment firm in White Plains, N.Y. Yankwitt has 10 employees and in recent years has done a lot of hiring.
As a result, Yankwitt says he's had many conversations about hiring, "both with respect to specific people, with respect to whether we should hire one junior person or two, whether we should hire a senior person."
He says his ultimate marginal tax rate "didn't even make it on the agenda."
Yankwitt says deciding to bring on another employee is all about return on investment. Will adding another person to the payroll make his company more successful?
For Jason Burger, the motivation is similar.
"If my taxes go up, I have slightly less disposable income, yes," said Burger, co-owner of CSS International Holdings, a global infrastructure contractor. "But that has nothing to do with what my business does. What my business does is based on the contracts that it wins and the demand for its services."
Burger says his Michigan-based company is hiring like crazy, and he'd be perfectly willing to pay the surtax.

"It's only fair that I put back into the system that is the entire reason for my success," said Burger.
For the record, both Burger and Yankwitt have made campaign contributions to Democrats in the past, but they say their views on the surtax are about the economics of their businesses and not their politics.
And they're not alone.
"I, like any other American, especially a business owner, I want to make as much money as I can and I want to keep as much money in my pocket as I can, but I also believe in the greater good," says Deborah Schwarz, who owns LAC Group, an information management firm with offices nationwide and in London.
Surtax or no, Schwarz says she hopes to keep hiring.
"We're going to keep on writing proposals, going after contracts, hopefully winning them, and when we do we're going to continue to hire people," says Schwarz.
All of this contradicts the arguments about job creators being made by Republicans in Congress.
"Those I would say were exceptions to the rule," responds Thune. "I think most small-business owners who are out there right now would argue that raising their taxes has the opposite effect that we would want to have in a down economy."
But those small-business owners apparently don't want to talk.
Tags: payroll tax cut extension, Congress

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Sid Harth (navanavonmilita)
Sid Harth (navanavonmilita) wrote:
Here is one for you, for interviewing on a live radio/video broadcast.
Being of a category falling right into the GOP version of millionaires, hiding all my income from my dollar pinching "Surtax evading, offshore (number account holding, illegal immigrants hiring and not reporting, chest thumping and turkey, two timing, Oops, two step trotting, bribing, PACing, lobbying, bobbing, dabbling (in stealth) politicking, humping, pumping, piping, sipping (Vodaka Martinis(three minimum) for breakfast, (four) for hurried (exclusive country clubs lunches, lasting at least four mid day) lunches, (five) for white tie dinners at (Stork Club or their various Avatars) late night bashes in the backrooms, full of (Havana) hand rolled cigar smoke of (Political) watering holes inside the (Washington) beltways, (Chicago) Loops, and Shanghai (illegal) Speakeasies.
I declare, under oath, that I hired a total of (big) zero, Oops, zilch new employes, during my entire career as a small (scale) business (of lying, cheating and shenaniganing) career, spanning better that six (glorious) decadent decades.
So surtax me, Oops, sue me in the court of law and get it over with.
Who is afraid of Democratic wolves?
...and I am Sid Harth@sidileaks.net
Sunday, December 11, 2011 9:15:30 AM
John Reay (jreay)
John Reay (jreay) wrote:
Objective analysis of supply side economics:
http://people.stern.nyu.edu/nroubini/SUPPLY.HTM
Here's the conclusion:
"So, in conclusion the verdict from history and empirical evidence is quite clear. Supply side economics is "voodoo economics". Reductions in tax rates (starting from initial moderate tax rate levels) do not siginificantly increase labor supply and savings, do not increase economic growth, do not raise total tax revenue and do not reduce budget deficits. Their likely effect on the level and growth rate on output is close to zero while they lead to significantly larger budget deficits."
Like I've said, conservatives cannot make a cogent argument in support of, well let's call it what it is; Trickle On Economics.
Sunday, December 11, 2011 9:11:07 AM
Robert Groetzlnger (gZinger)
Robert Groetzlnger (gZinger) wrote:
Not only out of touch with the working joe but also out of touch with the ones they champion
Sunday, December 11, 2011 9:08:50 AM
jon zwieg (jonzwieg)
jon zwieg (jonzwieg) wrote:
Wonder how random their sample of millionaires really was... perhaps pre-selected to guarantee a result in the story?
Sunday, December 11, 2011 8:17:12 AM
Chris Berg (lchrisberg)
Chris Berg (lchrisberg) wrote:
@Roberto Rodriguez (BobLobLawsClaw):
"Then the one who had received the one talent came and said, 'Sir, I knew that you were a hard man, harvesting where you did not sow, and gathering where you did not scatter seed, so I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. See, you have what is yours.'
But his master answered, 'Evil and lazy slave! So you knew that I harvest where I didn’t sow and gather where I didn’t scatter? Then you should have deposited my money with the bankers, and on my return I would have received my money back with interest!
Therefore take the talent from him and give it to the one who has ten. For the one who has will be given more, and he will have more than enough. But the one who does not have, even what he has will be taken from him.
And throw that worthless slave into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth'" (Matthew 25:24-30).
Since you like Matthew, I threw that one in there as well. It's kind of like God's trifecta on wealth and the pursuit of the material world. The three are something to think about on a Sunday morning.
Some say this last one is contradictory. I couldn't disagree more. That just means you don't get it.
Sunday, December 11, 2011 8:09:33 AM
Chris Berg (lchrisberg)
Chris Berg (lchrisberg) wrote:
@H W (CheChe) wrote:
"With all due respect Chris, where was Big Brother when those 29 miners died at the Massey mine in VA? Where was big brother when Blankenship saw only "prices" and not people?
Price (nor free market) does not dictate everything. Free markets will not settle issues when corporations (people?) try to corner a market - see the Hunt Brothers - some things are still against the law, such as anti trust and other market manipulation tactics.
I am not saying that free enterprise is bad - just that their are some really bad actors out there, that even free markets can not control. Even "free markets" are not totally free."
I don't totally disagree with your positions. Accidents happen when people are careless with safety in their drive for profits. No doubt. That is a good type of regulation and completely different than the interference in the free markets I was referring. Quite frankly, you are mixing apples with oranges.
Your last point IS relevant. Government's one legitimate role in markets is to prevent monopolies. It is not to pick winners and losers in the market place. That is the role of the people through their daily votes in the markets.
Sunday, December 11, 2011 7:56:27 AM
Chris Berg (lchrisberg)
Chris Berg (lchrisberg) wrote:
@Roberto Rodriguez (BobLobLawsClaw) wrote:
"@ Chris Berg (lchrisberg) wrote:
Really. Immoral, you say. Hmmm… Here’s an interesting position on the subject.
"Neither shalt thou covet thy neighbour's house, his field, or his manservant, or his maidservant, his ox, or his a$$, or any thing that is thy neighbour's."
It seems to me that God does not agree with you. That’s a direct quote from one of his Big Ten no-nos. Deuteronomy 5:21
-----------------------------
" Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. " Matthew 19:24
But I guess religion is only relevant when it is convenient to your personal agenda right?"
No. That is a completely relevant quote and in line with mine.
The relevant point is to not live an immoral material life. Just as the coverter, the one willing to use governmental force to achieve his means, will pay the spiritual price, so too will the wealthy man that lets his pursuit of the material world blind him to the needs of those around him.
The are both immoral and both damned....probably end up right next to each other in Hell.
Sunday, December 11, 2011 7:50:02 AM
SGK KNO (SGK1212)
SGK KNO (SGK1212) wrote:
Bob Potter is clearly upset that some people have more than he has. Well, just get the government to take it from them Bob!
Sunday, December 11, 2011 6:32:06 AM
Alex Miller (WhatIsThePointOfThisNickname)
Alex Miller (WhatIsThePointOfThisNickname) wrote:
Government policy really doesn't affect the economy as much as politicians claim. To blame or give credit to anyone who's in office based on the status of the economy is completely misguided. That's why I'm not voting for anyone who claims they are going "fix the economy". (Guess that makes my ballot easy!)
The fact of the matter, however, is that our media has inundated us with the message "America. Economy. Bad." So the American public—without missing a step—cries out "Want. Economy. Moar. Good." Which explains our present situation of politicians pandering to our misguided demands. Any politician who claims he's going to fix the economy either (1) actually believes he's going to fix it, or (2) knows that his actions are of little consequence, but knows that's what the public wants to hear. In case (1), he's an idi0t; in case (2) he's a little more savvy, but apparently is only interested in "winning the election"—which means he's actually not interested in the good of the public.
Anyway... I guess you could say I have no faith in our national political process.
Sunday, December 11, 2011 4:58:30 AM
Roberto Rodriguez (BobLobLawsClaw)
Roberto Rodriguez (BobLobLawsClaw) wrote:
@ Chris Berg (lchrisberg) wrote:
Really. Immoral, you say. Hmmm…
Here’s an interesting position on the subject.
"Neither shalt thou covet thy neighbour's house, his field, or his manservant, or his maidservant, his ox, or his a$$, or any thing that is thy neighbour's."
It seems to me that God does not agree with you. That’s a direct quote from one of his Big Ten no-nos.
Deuteronomy 5:21
-----------------------------
" Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. " Matthew 19:24
But I guess religion is only relevant when it is convenient to your personal agenda right?
Sunday, December 11, 2011 12:23:39 AM
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